Presidential Nomination Polls

Just as a curiosity I figured I would set up some quick polls on the potential Green, Libertarian, and Constitution party nominees…

http://thirdpartywatch.com/2008-presidential-polls/

This is not scientific, obviously. Rather it’s just a way to get some sense of how TPW readers feel about the race so far.

Some of the candidates I included are currently declared and actively seeking their party’s nomination. Others are people who’ve generated significant buzz as a potential candidate.

I tried to keep the choices relatively realistic. If you want to write-in someone else, you are free to do so.

152 Responses to “Presidential Nomination Polls”

  1. Phil Sawyer Says:

    The system would not let me cast my write-in vote for the Green Party nomination: Angela Davis.

  2. Devin Ray Freeman Says:

    I wanted to choose two, but it would only let me choose one, so I didn’t vote.

  3. Austin Cassidy Says:

    Phil,

    It looks like your vote for Angela Davis was added as a comment rather than a write-in. FreePolls is a little strange sometimes, but I do see it listed there and will include it when I post the final totals in a few days.

    -Austin

  4. Austin Cassidy Says:

    Devin,

    Sorry.

    -Austin

  5. NewFederalist Says:

    Worked just fine for me!

  6. Carl Says:

    I voted Ron Paul for the libertarians. It was not counted (under “other”) but it was listed among the suggestions.

  7. Trent Hill Says:

    Austin,is that a new banner i see? I like it.

  8. Jeff Becker Says:

    Interesting that Ron Paul is the leading “other” nominee for both the Libertarian AND Constitution parties. If Dr. Paul does not secure the Republican nomination (fingers crossed longshot), could this lead to a fusion candidate amongst these two parties?

    Ron Paul is pro-Life, but at the state level, not federal level. Is that a reasonable stance on this issue to satisfy both libertarians and constitutionalists? I would tend to think so as his name was mentioned at last month’s Constitution Party meeting in NH.

    QUESTION #2: How would this mesh with the recent “split” in the LP (moderates vs. Ayn Rand objectivists – gutted platform vs. new Boston Tea Party).

    QUESTION #3: How would a fusion Presidential candidate agree on a Vice Presidential nominee?

  9. Eric Dondero Says:

    Wayne Root is featured on Newsmax.com today in the “US” section. His column is “My Libertarian Awakening.”

    www.newsmax.com

  10. Trent Hill Says:

    Jeff Becker, there are definetly alot of questions here.
    Ron Paul’s pro life stance is in agreement with ALOT of CPers personal beliefs. The arguement over whether Abortion should be banned nationally or in the states is a heated one in the CP.
    A fusion candidacy would be really hard to work out. Especially between the minarchist libertarians and right wing CPers. The ballot-access portion would be, I think, the hardest to work out. Ideally, Paul would be on the ballot in the states where the CP has ballot-access,and then would donate funds to the LP who would then use extra funds to attain ballot access in the other states. This, theoretically, could get into 50 states and DC/Guam.
    Ron Paul has also been invited to MANY CP events, and has showed to a few.
    Ron Paul actually seems more consistant with the CP platform than the LP one.
    At any rate, The Vice Presidential candidate would probably have to be based on who spent less money on the campaigns. I believe the CP has significantly less fund raising power than the LP. So the LP would probably get the ticket. But it would need to be someone both parties could agree with?

    Also, how big is the Boston Tea Party?

  11. Andy Says:

    “Trent Hill Says:

    January 29th, 2007 at 10:23 pm
    Jeff Becker, there are definetly alot of questions here.
    Ron Paul’s pro life stance is in agreement with ALOT of CPers personal beliefs. The arguement over whether Abortion should be banned nationally or in the states is a heated one in the CP.
    A fusion candidacy would be really hard to work out. Especially between the minarchist libertarians and right wing CPers. The ballot-access portion would be, I think, the hardest to work out. Ideally, Paul would be on the ballot in the states where the CP has ballot-access,and then would donate funds to the LP who would then use extra funds to attain ballot access in the other states. This, theoretically, could get into 50 states and DC/Guam.
    Ron Paul has also been invited to MANY CP events, and has showed to a few.
    Ron Paul actually seems more consistant with the CP platform than the LP one.”

    I’m wouldn’t be so sure about that. Ron Paul opposes the War on Drugs and he also opposes protectionist tarriffs. Ron opposes laws against gambling and other vices, of course these shouldn’t be considered federal issues though.

  12. Trent Hill Says:

    Agreed. I believe he probably does oppose Gambling and other vices,simply on a state level. That is a compromise we can both accept,right?

    I agree,he opposes the War on Drugs and Protectionist Tarriffs.
    The CP supports A war on drugs, but not The War On Drugs, as it is a gross over-expenditure and theft of rights.

    So the real difference is Protectionist Tarriffs. One which we can live with.

    His differences with the Libertarian Party are pretty heavy in some areas tho.
    He wants closed borders.
    He is pro-life (state level)
    He voted for the Defense of Marriage Act.

    Those are some pretty big issues on which he disagrees with the LP.

  13. Phil Sawyer Says:

    Thanks, Austin!

  14. Jackcjackson Says:

    Ron Paul won’t run on either LP or CP.

    I am also not sure of some of those views are actually “state level” or “personal level.” In other words a lot of Libertarians don’t use drugs or gamble but don’t believe in legislating their own personal tastes at ANY level. Others do the whole “Federalism” thing, where apparently it is OK to make terrible anti-freedom ( anti-individual and “anti-American) laws as long as its the local bigots and not the Feds.

  15. Jackcjackson Says:

    That said, I don’t exactly know Paul’s stances on all those issues as it pertains to the role of government ( his personal preferences being almost irrelevant), be it true freedom or solely based on constitutionalism/federalism..But if his beliefs are closer to CP, well the CP can have him. The LP ( and CP too probably) can do better. The GOP probably can’t though, but the wont see that.

  16. Andy Says:

    “Trent Hill Says:

    January 29th, 2007 at 11:11 pm
    Agreed. I believe he probably does oppose Gambling and other vices,simply on a state level. That is a compromise we can both accept,right?”

    No, I’m pretty sure that Ron believes that these should be legal activities and even in a state or local office he would not attempt to outlaw them.

    I’d be willing to bet (pun intended) that Ron doesn’t like the internet poker ban.

  17. Andy Says:

    “His differences with the Libertarian Party are pretty heavy in some areas tho.
    He wants closed borders.
    He is pro-life (state level)
    He voted for the Defense of Marriage Act.

    Those are some pretty big issues on which he disagrees with the LP.”

    No they aren’t.

    There is a lot of debate in Libertarian circles on immigration. The fact of the matter is that IF we had a real libertarian society all land would be in private hands and it would be up to land owners as to who could immigrate to where. Some people would have very open immigrations polices while others would have various restrictions. The problem today is that we’ve got a welfare state which many immigrants – as well as their offspring who often times are not counted in the statistics because they are counted as American citizens if they are born here – end up falling into – whether they intended to do so or not. There are also many immigrants who are criminals, many of whom are gang members, and many of these gangs profit from the black market drug trade. IF we could eliminate the welfare state and the drug war a lot of the immigration problems would fix themselves. However, the key word here is IF. So unless we can eliminate the welfare state and the Drug War the immigration situation will continue to be plagued with problems. In addition to this, there is also the fact that the “powers that be” – as in the global elitist who control the government and all the big corporations – want the immigration situation to continue as it is and in fact they are the ones who are behind it. Why? Because they want to destroy this country and create a North American Union which will be the next step towards global government. Ron Paul is well aware of this plan and is trying to stop it. Ron Paul is NOT anti-immigrant like some people are making him out to be. Saying that Ron Paul opposes all immigrants is a complete distortion of his position. Ron Paul is trying to STOP global government and keep welfare recipients and criminal gang bangers out of the country.

    There are a lot of Libertarians who oppose abortion. Some think that it should go back to the states and that states should outlaw it. Others are anarchists and favor killing abortion doctors. Some don’t believe in abortion but think that government should still stay out of it because government screws everything up that it gets involved in and favor using persausion to urge women to not get abortions. Some believe that if we get government out of the way there could soon be advancements in technology that would make abortion obsolete, as in cryogenic freezing. All Libertarians (including pro-choicers) do not believe that the government should fund abortions (anyone who would support tax payer funding of abortions is not a libertarian in my opinion).

    As I’ve said over and over again, I do not consider abortion to be a definition issue due to the fact that you can’t determine when individual rights begin. This should NOT be regaurded as a litmus test issue becaue neither side can prove their case.

    The only reason that Ron voted for the Defense of Marriage Act is because he doesn’t believe that marriage should be federalized. Ron also voted against the proposed anti-gay marriage amendment.

  18. Andy Says:

    “I agree,he opposes the War on Drugs and Protectionist Tarriffs.
    The CP supports A war on drugs, but not The War On Drugs, as it is a gross over-expenditure and theft of rights.”

    Ron Paul does not support any war on drugs. His position is not in line with the Constitution Party. Check out Ron Pual’s picture on the NORML (National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws) website.

    http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=6959

  19. Trent Hill Says:

    Im aware of his stance Andy. But alot of people around here seem to believe that the CP support the war on drugs.
    They dont, they support a restriction of drug useage, however, they do not advocate utilizing the current Drug War.

  20. Nat Turner Says:

    Hey Andy, why stop there?

    Change the word immigrant for blacks in your latest rant.

    “Until we get rid of welfare, we should all agree to have Jim Crow (it’s ok, it’s just at the state level) segregation”

    or maybe…

    “Well it’s easier politically to ship all the Blacks to Africa than to end welfare. We’ll just do it until we end welfare.”

    Oh, but where are you going to ship the Native Americans? Have you seen the crime and welfare stats on the rez?

    Never mind the whole lobertarian odea of threating people as INDIVIDUALS and not member of groups, that falls somewhere by the way side as we puruse States Rights, Constitutionalism, National Collective Ownership of the Homeland, and a merger with the Constitution Party (you can violate civil rights and civil liberties all you want, so long as it’s at the state level! Women’s wombs are property of the state! Free trade and free association will be governed by National Capitalism! etc).

    Now you and Ron Paul can triangulate and obfuscate these differences all you want but they are not going away.

    Oh, I guess Howard Phillips saying hang drug dealers and have the coast guard shoot smugglers out of the water, along with putting the military at the borderder is not mean they are for the war on drugs. No sir.

    It’ll just be at the local and state level because we all know that local police don’t violate anyone’s rights and never have. Why George Wallace would have been a great Libertarian candidate right? “Supporrt your local police” liekk the ones that do 100,000 swat raid per year.

    But that is chicken feed because we also want to get the US military in on the job since they will be coming home from around the world, but we can’t just demilitarize them, hey we want to win elections too! No, we’ll put them to work guarding the border and have a war on immigrants, war on gambling, war on abortion, war on porn, war on forein goods smhggling because we’ll be using high tariffs to pay for all these other wars.

    Hey the Libertarians can just fall in line with that, it’s either that or the World War 3 with the phony bullshit islanmo fascism, but we;ll be ok with the dope, gambling etc., but hey it’s ok if your mail and phone is tapped and anyone who is against the war is declared a enemy combatant and disappears into a secret prison, it’ll be great just like “Brace new World”

    Chose one or the other, or why even choose? You can combine the two and Vote Republican. After all we are really just a conservative right wing faction. We can have the wars at home AND the wars abroad. How can you beat that in getting the votes of the munitions industries amd potential government contractors and everyone who will make mney from the stock? I think the LP can jsut lock that up by just getting more extreme than the Republicans on all tehse issues right?

    We’‘ll ,merge all 3 parties and have a united front.

    But hey it’s ok as long as the libertarians take one of these two Republikkkan elements of thought and remain firmly commited reightwingers everything will be OK.

    Just remember the state owns all the wombs and sexual organs in the country so its OK to ban gay sex and abortion and it allso jointly owns the whole country period so why not kick out the immigrants?

    Hey they’re all just a bunch of gangbangers and welfare cases, and if a few of them are not hey they look or maybe sound like the ones who are so it’s all real libertarian to treat them all the same. Yeah, when WE want to allow them into OUR country WE will just vote about it right?

    maybe we can vote about what everybody has for breakfast too. We’ll have a national diet plan but only until we get rid of teh welfare state.

    Logic people!

  21. Eric Dondero Says:

    Austin, glad to see you can only vote once in this poll. A lot of on-line polls are flawed cause people can simply vote as many times as they like. For my money Vizu.com offers the best polls for websites.

    BTW, if anyone is interested I run a regular poll for your “Favorite Libertarian Celebrity,” up at www.politicalquiz.us. In includes Eastwood, Bruce Willis, Jon Stewart, Kurt Russell, Tammy Bruce, Ted Nuget, et.al.

  22. Roscoe Says:

    Yawn. Ron Paul is a comparative giant to the midgets seeking the major party nominations. Still, a snowball has more chance on a Phoenix sidewalk in August.

  23. Eric Dondero Says:

    Rudy Giuliani is a Giant of Giants compared to Ron Paul. Giuliani is the Hero of 9/11. How soon we all have forgotten, his bravery and leadership in the wake of the attack by the Islamo-Fascists. How sad indeed.

    Ron Paul was a good Congressman in the late 1990s. His time has past. Rudy is the best choice for Libertarians in 2008!! And he’s far more of a principled libertarian than Ron Paul.

    Eric Dondero – Former 12-year staffer, US Congressman Ron Paul

  24. NewFederalist Says:

    Giuliani may be a hero of 9-11 but how you can say he is more of a “principled libertarian than Ron Paul” defies belief! He fails the “libertarian” test on gun rights alone.

  25. Eric Dondero Says:

    Just breaking…

    The London Herald-Tribune is reporting that Libertarian Billionaire Paul Singer has endorsed Rudy Giuliani for President. Singer, is a NYC Hedge Fund Manager. He’s regarded as one of the Top Three Richest Libetarians in the Nation, right up there with David Koch, and Howie Rich. Singer also is a Board Member of the libertarian Manhattan Institute.

    Full story and link now up at www.mainstreamlibertarian.com

  26. Darcy G. Richardson Says:

    “The London Herald-Tribune is reporting that Libertarian Billionaire Paul Singer has endorsed Rudy Giuliani for President.”—- Eric Dondero

    Wasn’t he one of Bush’s major fundraisers in 2004? In addition to screwing the poor folks in Peru out of something like $47 million, I think he also helped to fund the notorious Swift Boat ads that year. Are we supposed to be impressed?

  27. Robert Says:

    I would like to see Russo join the race.

  28. Robert Says:

    correct web page

  29. james Says:

    Mr. Dondero, you are a total joke. Please stop. You are not convincing anyone, only wasting your time.

    The Giuliani hero worship over 9/11 is astounding and a complete myth. Google Giuliani + 9/11 or start with this link: http://dailygotham.com/blog/paul/giulianis_9_11_myth_begins_to_take_on_water

  30. Andy Says:

    “Trent Hill Says:

    January 30th, 2007 at 2:47 am
    Im aware of his stance Andy. But alot of people around here seem to believe that the CP support the war on drugs.
    They dont, they support a restriction of drug useage, however, they do not advocate utilizing the current Drug War.”

    This sounds like double speak to me. How is saying that you support a restriction of drug usage not the same as supporting the War on Drugs? Even if you all intend to primarily fight the Drug War at the state level that is still supporting the War on Drugs.

  31. Andy Says:

    “BTW, if anyone is interested I run a regular poll for your “Favorite Libertarian Celebrity,” up at www.politicalquiz.us. In includes Eastwood, Bruce Willis, Jon Stewart, Kurt Russell, Tammy Bruce, Ted Nuget, et.al.”

    Tammy Bruce does not belong on that list. Neither does Bruce Willis although last I heard about Bruce Willis he was beginning to question the War in Iraq and the War on Terror in general so perhaps he is becomming more libertarian. At this point I’d say it is still too early to call Bruce Willis a libertarian. I like Ted Nugent but he’s not quite a libertarian either.

  32. wnw3 Says:

    In one of the books written by Tammy Bruce, she said she thought she was a libertarian for a short while but then she realized she wasn’t, and what I took to be an insult, she insulted everyone who claimed to be libertarian.

  33. wnw3 Says:

    Ted Nugent is hard core Republican. I can’t find anywhere on the web that has Ted saying he is libertarian.

  34. Andy Says:

    “wnw3 Says:

    January 30th, 2007 at 8:21 pm
    In one of the books written by Tammy Bruce, she said she thought she was a libertarian for a short while but then she realized she wasn’t, and what I took to be an insult, she insulted everyone who claimed to be libertarian.”

    Yeah, I’ve listened to Tammy Bruce before and she didn’t sound remotely libertarian to me. I thought that she was a typical fascist RepubliCON.

    “Ted Nugent is hard core Republican. I can’t find anywhere on the web that has Ted saying he is libertarian.”

    I like Ted Nugent as a muscisian and a person (from what I’ve read and heard from him) and I like the fact that he’s hardcore gun rights advocate, but I think that he’s missing too many “pieces from the puzzle” to be a libertarian. Between Ted Nugent and Tammy Bruce I’d say that Ted is closer to being a libertarian.

  35. wnw3 Says:

    Now here is a question. Can someone be a Republican and a Democrat at the same time?

  36. Darcy G. Richardson Says:

    “Can someone be a Republican and a Democrat at the same time?”

    Yeah, there are about 435 of them currently in the U.S. House of Representatives and another 100 in the U.S. Senate.

  37. wnw3 Says:

    LOL! Now that made me laugh.

  38. Eric Dondero Says:

    Of course, if you are an Anarchist pretending to be a libertarian, Ted Nugent, Rudy Giuliani, Tammy Bruce, et.al. would not appear to be “libertarian” from your standpoint.

    That’s the problem with Anarchists. They refuse to acknowledge that such an individual as a Moderate Libertarian actually exists. In the Anarchist world, you either worship at the alter of Murray Rothbard and L. Neil Smith or you’re not entitled to use the term “libertarian.”

    The Anarchists think they can co-opt our libertarian term. Over my dead body. Unless they can kill me it will never happen. And I plan to live a long, long life. My Grandmother died at 93. That’s 50 some years left to go.

    And don’t even think about trying to harm me. This Texas redneck has got a meanass Rotweiler at his side 24/7. And she’s damned protective.

    Some Moderate Libertarian sites:

    www.mainstreamlibertarian.com

    www.moderatelibertarian.blogspot.com

    www.gopprogress.com

  39. Karl Says:

    In the world of Eric Dondero you can be a warmongering fascist and still call yourself a libertarian.

    Bizarro world indeed!

  40. George Whitfield Says:

    Here are two new articles about our Libertarian hero Ron Paul:

    Rep. Ron Paul: Running to Win in 2008
    Dave Eberhart
    Wednesday, Jan. 31, 2007
    http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2007/1/30/151713.shtml?s=lh

    and

    Inflation: The Hidden Cost of War by Rep. Ron Paul, Jan. 30, 2007
    http://www.antiwar.com/paul/?articleid=10423

    I have mailed another contribution to the Ron Paul Exploratory Committee and encourage all libertarians to chip in. See: http://www.ronpaul.org

  41. Trent Hill Says:

    Dondero, Congratulations on your grandmothers age. Cookie?

    “This sounds like double speak to me. How is saying that you support a restriction of drug usage not the same as supporting the War on Drugs? Even if you all intend to primarily fight the Drug War at the state level that is still supporting the War on Drugs.”
    Andy, I understand why that might be confusing. Allow me to elaborate. The Constitution Party is not against the restriction of Drug Useage. They ARE against the War on Drugs. Why? The War on Drugs uses certain deplorable methods and gross overexpenditure to achieve (or fail) its goals. The USA spent 4.7 billion on Plan Columbia (which is too much money already) and this was an effort to end coco production in South America, something which is not within the United States’ Governments Constitutional limitations. See what i mean now? The CP supports a restriction of drug useage, but not the methods that the War on Drugs uses (nor the amount of money). Hopefully that made it more clear.

  42. Eric Dondero Says:

    In the World of “Karl” you can be in favor of Islamo-Fascism, let the Islamo-Fascists take over your country and outlaw all civil liberties, and still call yourself a “libertarian.”

    It’s like “Libertarians Against Prostitution,” or “Libertarians for Prohibition,” or “Libertarians for Strict Drug Laws,” or “Libertarians for Sexual Prudishness,” or “Libertarians for Outlawing All Pornography,” or “Libertarians Against Choice on Abortion,” or “Libertarians for Jailing Gays.”

    Bizarre indeed.

  43. Eric Dondero Says:

    In the world of “Karl” you can be a pussy-boy non-Military serving yellow-bellied coward and still call yourself a “libertarian” or “defender of liberty.”

    Truly bizarre.

  44. Karl Says:

    Yes, I can see the islamo-fascists on their way. Just like the trumped up charges on Padilla and the gang with no shoes in Miami.

    Maybe, if we stopped meddling in their land they would have no reason to even want to come over here.

    It’s like “Libertarians for Death,” or “Libertarians for Genocide,” or “Libertarians for Cultural Suicide,” or “Libertarians for War on a Religion,” or “Libertarians for War on Some Elusive Goal,” or “Libertarians for Death to an Ideology,” or “Libertarians to Kill to Make Us Feel Warm and Fuzzy Inside and Compensate for My Small Penis.”

  45. Karl Says:

    Who exactly are we liberating and/or defending in Iraq currently?

    What is it our cherished men and women in uniform are dying for exactly in the streets of Baghdad at this very moment?

    And, how is it you know for sure I am a “pussy-boy non-Military serving yellow-bellied coward?”

    I’ll have you know I have done a lot more for the defense of this country than just a congressional aide, I just choose not to boast about it in every god damn post you pathetic scumbag!

  46. Phil Sawyer Says:

    Eric D.: With all due respect, my friend, I would like to repeat what I wrote recently about the RLC: It is time to take down the tent and go home.

    The RLC situation is very similar to that of the DSA and its work, primarily, within the Democratic Party. It was a good and noble idea but it has been tried and found to be wanting. The Donkey Party is like the Borg, in “Star Trek” – it tries to assimilate, absorb, and render insignificant any person or group that is in its path. It usually gets its way.

    Representatives Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich are decent and honorable gentlemen and I wish them the best of luck in their respective races for the Republican and Democratic Party presidential nominations. However, I will not hold my breath waiting for either of them to be victorious in such a quest.

    “But wait, there’s more” – as the capitalists like to say. As someone who has been a member, in the past, of both major parties, I will say that I had some good learning experiences and wonderful times, but I have learned my lesson. The only way that we are going to bring significant change to this country is to go outside the two-party system.

    So: Let the DSA (and CPUSA, and PDA) play their liberal games. If they so wish, also let the RCA play its conservative games. Personally, “my name is Bennett and I am not in it.” This is political warfare!

  47. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    January 30th, 2007 at 9:42 pm
    Of course, if you are an Anarchist pretending to be a libertarian, Ted Nugent, Rudy Giuliani, Tammy Bruce, et.al. would not appear to be “libertarian” from your standpoint.

    That’s the problem with Anarchists. They refuse to acknowledge that such an individual as a Moderate Libertarian actually exists. In the Anarchist world, you either worship at the alter of Murray Rothbard and L. Neil Smith or you’re not entitled to use the term “libertarian.”

    The Anarchists think they can co-opt our libertarian term. Over my dead body. Unless they can kill me it will never happen. And I plan to live a long, long life. My Grandmother died at 93. That’s 50 some years left to go.”

    I don’t believe that one has to be an anarchist to be a libertarian. A principled minarchist can still be a libertarian in my opinion. For instance, Michael Badnarik is a strict constitutionalist minarchist and he’s still a libertarian in my book.

    Ted Nugent doesn’t quite make the cut for being a libertarian. From what I know of him he’s closer to being a libertarian than some of the other clowns you bring up as supposedly being libertarians.

    As I’ve said above, I’ve listened to Tammy Bruce’s radio show and I didn’t think that she was even remotely libertarian.

    Rudy Giuliani a libertarian, that is a FREAKINJOKE. Giuliani is a typical big government politician and he’s got a horrible record on civil liberties. Rudi supports gun control laws. Rudi is a drug warrior. Rudi did nothing about police brutality. And as a Mixed Martial Arts (MMA) fan, I was really pissed of when Rudi got an Extreme Fighting event and MMA in general banned in New York City (ie-censorship). Tell us Eric, how is any of this libertarian?

  48. Andy Says:

    “Andy, I understand why that might be confusing. Allow me to elaborate. The Constitution Party is not against the restriction of Drug Useage. They ARE against the War on Drugs. Why? The War on Drugs uses certain deplorable methods and gross overexpenditure to achieve (or fail) its goals. The USA spent 4.7 billion on Plan Columbia (which is too much money already) and this was an effort to end coco production in South America, something which is not within the United States’ Governments Constitutional limitations. See what i mean now? The CP supports a restriction of drug useage, but not the methods that the War on Drugs uses (nor the amount of money). Hopefully that made it more clear.”

    Trent, I remember Howard Phillips saying that he favored using the federal government to prevent drugs from entering the country (I’ve got this on video from the two minor party presidential debates from 2000), but that the states could decide for themselves what to do about drugs. I know that at the state level the Constitution Party favors drug prohibition and at least some members of the party favor executing drug dealers. This sure sounds like a drug war to me.

    By what constitutional authority does the federal government have to stop people from importing drugs into the country? Would this apply to alchohol as well since alchohol is a drug? If so, keep in mind that Alchohol Prohibition was repealed. Is the Constitution Party looking to amend the Constitution to give the federal government the authority to prohibit the drug trade, or are they just going to ignore the Constitution on this issue like the Republicans and Democrats do?

    I’ve read several state Constitutions and I don’t recall seeing anything in the ones that I read that gave the states in question any authority to wage a drug war? How can you possibly wage a drug war without violating the Bill Of Rights?

  49. Bill Wood Says:

    Eric, wouldn’t the people you call Moderate Libertarians be more like Moderate Republicans since they are Republicans and they do not support the Libertarian Party, and they do not believe in a small, limited government?

  50. John Brown Says:

    Bill, they would be Moderate fascists.

    Giuiliani is just a modern day Mussolini.

    You can go down the list and their views and action are very similar.

    If Dondero was born in early 1900s Italy he would start Libertarians for Mussolini.

    In fact, I have it on good authority that his grandfather did just that.

  51. Bill Wood Says:

    John great to see your post. Somewhere, awhile back someone posted a list . Something like the ten steps of a Fascist governemnt, and how G.W had coverd nine of those steps. Maybe someone here might remember this?

  52. Trent Hill Says:

    Andy,

    Im aware that Philips wants to restrict drug useage, and even wage A war on drugs. But this is different than THE War on Drugs. In principle, to a libertarian, they are equally evil. But the fact is that one of them will spend MUCH less money, and will not curtail AS MANY freedoms (I would say none, but obviously we have differing opinions on that.)
    Im not argueing the merits of drug legalization or prohibition. Im stating the CP’s position.

    Also Andy, do you think you could send that video to me? Iv been tryigt o find third-party candidate debates.

  53. Bill Wood Says:

    wnw newsservice: Dateline USA,

    “Leading contenders for the White House aren’t sure which big government political party they will be representing in next year’s election, since it is difficult to tell the two major parties apart.” stated an unnamed source. There is a possiblity that all candidates will gather together and do a coin toss. Heads that person will be the Republican Party nominee tails they’ll be the Democrat Party’s candidate. Another unnamed source said “it is great that all the Candidates for President this year are libertarian.”...story developing

  54. George Whitfield Says:

    There is a history lesson and thoughtful analysis of the upcoming campaign for the Republican Presidential nomination. It concludes with an endorsement of Congressman Ron Paul:

    The More the Merrier is not the Case with GOP Presidential Field
    by Sean Scallon, January 31, 2007

    Here is the link: http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/viewArticle.asp?articleID=19942

  55. Eric Dondero Says:

    Hey Andy, why even have the suffix “chist” at all?

    I am not a Minarchist. I think the term is ridiculous. I’m a Mainstream Libertarian.

    This is not between Anarchists and Minarchists.

    Firstly, Anarchists are not even in the equation. They are off the charts. They don’t count.

    The fault lines in the Libertarian movement are between Radical Libertarians (mostly Libertarian Party), Mainstream Libertarians (Libertarian Republicans and LP Reformers), and Moderate Libertarians (Liz Mair and GOPProgress.com and other Fiscal Conservatives).

  56. Eric Dondero Says:

    Bill Wood:

    Not all the people who are Moderate Libertarians are “Republicans.”

    Look at Bruce Cohen. He’s Chairman of the largest Libertarian Party County affiliate in the Nation, and Co-Host of the annual largest LP Convention in the Nation: Orange County LP Chairman and Caliornia LP Conv. Host.

    Bruce’s views and mine are virtually identical. We are ideological twins. We’re Mainstream Libertarians who wish to move the libertarian movement into the political mainstream.

    Bruce is a passionate Libertarian Party supporter. I respect that, as his friend. I’m a passionate Republican supporter. He respects me on that.

    Besides Bruce there’s all the gents in the Libertarian Reform Caucus, Bob Hunt, Tim Starr, Jeannie Starr, and a whole host of other “Moderate or Mainstream Libetarians” who are Libertarian Party members.

    Yes, most Moderate Libertarians are Republicans. But many are LPers.

  57. Eric Dondero Says:

    Andy, what Giuliani did on that fighting thing, sucks. What he did to the prostitutes in Times Square sucks too.

    But this race is already looking to be a two-person field. I was watching the news tonight and all they’re talking about on CNN and Fox is Rudy this, Hillary that. Hillary that, Rudy this.

    McCain is already fading from the scene. The stuff about Burak Obama’s Msulim Madrassa connection, is killing him, even though the mainstream media is not reporting on it.

    Mitt Romney is still strong and a contender. And I’ll admit he could still catch Rudy.

    On the Dem side, Bill Richardson could put a scare into Hillary.

    But when it’s all said and done, this is all going to be about Rudy Giuliani versus Madame Clinton.

    Yes, Rudy has some downpoints. I am pissed at him for the Prostitution thing. But I’ll overlook that. His positives far outweigh his negatives.

    Hillary doesn’t have a single positive as far as I can see. Well, one. At least she’s not Obama.

  58. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    January 31st, 2007 at 11:41 pm
    Andy, what Giuliani did on that fighting thing, sucks. What he did to the prostitutes in Times Square sucks too.”

    Therefore Giuliani is NOT a libertarian. He’s not even close to being a libertarian. So why in the hell do you keep tying to pawn him off as a libertarian when I think even you know that he’s NOT a libertarian?

    “But this race is already looking to be a two-person field. I was watching the news tonight and all they’re talking about on CNN and Fox is Rudy this, Hillary that. Hillary that, Rudy this.”

    And this suprises you? Of course the controlled mainstream media is going to push two candidates that suck. This is nothing new. It happens every election.

    McCain is already fading from the scene. The stuff about Burak Obama’s Msulim Madrassa connection, is killing him, even though the mainstream media is not reporting on it.

    “Mitt Romney is still strong and a contender. And I’ll admit he could still catch Rudy.

    On the Dem side, Bill Richardson could put a scare into Hillary.

    But when it’s all said and done, this is all going to be about Rudy Giuliani versus Madame Clinton.”

    “Yes, Rudy has some downpoints. I am pissed at him for the Prostitution thing. But I’ll overlook that. His positives far outweigh his negatives.”

    Rudy has SOME downpoints. I’d say that he’s got a lot of downpoints.

    All of these candidates suck, so who gives a shit? The Democrats will pick somebody that sucks and the Republicans will pick somebody that sucks, this is a given.

    “Hillary doesn’t have a single positive as far as I can see. Well, one. At least she’s not Obama.”

    Hillary is closer to your views than you’d like to admitt. She supports the war.

  59. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    January 31st, 2007 at 11:33 pm
    Hey Andy, why even have the suffix “chist” at all?

    I am not a Minarchist. I think the term is ridiculous. I’m a Mainstream Libertarian.

    This is not between Anarchists and Minarchists.

    Firstly, Anarchists are not even in the equation. They are off the charts. They don’t count.”

    Who are you to say that anarchists don’t count? Taking the libertarian philosophy to its logical conclusion is to have a voluntary society which would mean the absense of government.

    Minarchists want signifigantly smaller government than we’ve got now but do not think that it is possible to eliminate all government.

    Both groups can be considered to be libertarians.

    “The fault lines in the Libertarian movement are between Radical Libertarians (mostly Libertarian Party), Mainstream Libertarians (Libertarian Republicans and LP Reformers), and Moderate Libertarians (Liz Mair and GOPProgress.com and other Fiscal Conservatives).”

    To build the libertarian movement we need to get the message to the public that libertarians are offering something totally different than the Democrats and Republicans. You try to blur the line between Libertarians and Republicans to the point where it makes it look like Republicans are libertarian lite or vice versa. When you promote a Republican who is clearly NOT in the ballpark of being a libertarian as if they were a libertarian – like Rudy Giuliani – I’d say that it is actually destructive to the movement because it turns a lot of people off. The Libertarian Party is NOT about “left vs. right”, it’s about the state vs. the individual. Our recruitment efforts should reach out to the left, right, and center (independents and non-voters), not just to the right.

    I helped get the Libertarian Party back on the ballot in New Mexico in 2005. Overall I got a great response from the public. I think that a lot of it was due to the fact that New Mexico was one of the target states that the Michael Badnarik for President campaign focused on. I was suprised at the number of people who ran up to me and said something like, “Is that for Michael Badnarik?” and then enthusiastically signed. One of the few negative responses I got was from some women who was probably in her 40s or 50s. She started screaming at me that George W. Bush was a libertarian and that he was the kind of person that libertarians want in office. I tried to explain to her that George W. Bush was not even remotely close to being a libertarian, and that he was in fact the exact opposite of a libertarian, but she had her mind made up that he was a libertarian and she said that I didn’t know what I was talking about. I brought up various examples of why Bush is not a libertarian and her response was that she had a Political Science degree and that I was not qualified to comment even though I informed her that I’d been a member of the Libertarian Party for over 9 years (at that point in time). Perhaps the reason that this women had the mistaken belief that George W. Bush is a libertarian is because she saw Eric Dondero’s “Libertarians For Bush” website.

  60. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    January 31st, 2007 at 11:37 pm
    Bill Wood:

    Not all the people who are Moderate Libertarians are “Republicans.”

    Look at Bruce Cohen. He’s Chairman of the largest Libertarian Party County affiliate in the Nation, and Co-Host of the annual largest LP Convention in the Nation: Orange County LP Chairman and Caliornia LP Conv. Host.

    Bruce’s views and mine are virtually identical. We are ideological twins. We’re Mainstream Libertarians who wish to move the libertarian movement into the political mainstream.

    Bruce is a passionate Libertarian Party supporter. I respect that, as his friend. I’m a passionate Republican supporter. He respects me on that.

    Besides Bruce there’s all the gents in the Libertarian Reform Caucus, Bob Hunt, Tim Starr, Jeannie Starr, and a whole host of other “Moderate or Mainstream Libetarians” who are Libertarian Party members.”

    I don’t consider Bruce Cohen to be much of a Libertarian. I attended the 2005 Libertarian Party of California State Convention and I was glad that Mark Selzer beat him in the election for Southern Vice Chair.

  61. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    January 31st, 2007 at 11:41 pm
    Andy, what Giuliani did on that fighting thing, sucks. What he did to the prostitutes in Times Square sucks too.

    Yes, Rudy has some downpoints. I am pissed at him for the Prostitution thing. But I’ll overlook that. His positives far outweigh his negatives.”

    It seems to me that Rudy has a lot in common with the “Islamofascists” that you rally against. Rudy is an Italian fascist, like Benito Mussolini.

  62. Andy Says:

    “Also Andy, do you think you could send that video to me? Iv been tryigt o find third-party candidate debates.”

    Trent, I could send you a copy of this. Of course I’d have to have a way to get a hold of you. I probably wouldn’t be able to send it for a while though.

  63. Trent Hill Says:

    Shotdown1027@yahoo.com

    thats my email. Hit me with it whenever you can.

  64. Bill Wood Says:

    Eric, when will Wayne Allyn Root have a Root for President website?

  65. Robert Says:

    Eric Dondero Says:

    January 31st, 2007 at 11:33 pm
    “Hey Andy, why even have the suffix “chist” at all?

    I am not a Minarchist. I think the term is ridiculous. I’m a Mainstream Libertarian.

    This is not between Anarchists and Minarchists.

    Firstly, Anarchists are not even in the equation. They are off the charts. They don’t count.

    The fault lines in the Libertarian movement are between Radical Libertarians (mostly Libertarian Party), Mainstream Libertarians (Libertarian Republicans and LP Reformers), and Moderate Libertarians (Liz Mair and GOPProgress.com and other Fiscal Conservatives).”

    where does Aaron Russo fit?

    The Presidency is a long shot but I am starting a movement to draft Aaron Russo for Congress or Senate in 08. please check out my webpage.

  66. Andy Says:

    “where does Aaron Russo fit?

    The Presidency is a long shot but I am starting a movement to draft Aaron Russo for Congress or Senate in 08. please check out my webpage.”

    Aaron Russo ran on a minarchist platform (as do most Libertarians).

  67. Andy Says:

    “where does Aaron Russo fit?

    The Presidency is a long shot but I am starting a movement to draft Aaron Russo for Congress or Senate in 08. please check out my webpage.”

    Aaron Russo is not interested in running for office right now. He was considering running for President as an independent or in the Republican primary, but now that Ron Paul is in the race Aaron Russo has dropped that idea and is backing Ron Paul. He urges everyone who wants less government to get behind Ron Paul and he wants to bombard New Hampshire and Iowa (the first two states for Republican primaries) with his movie “America: From Freedom To Fascism” ( www.freedomtofascism.com ).

  68. Eric Dondero Says:

    Bill, good question. We’re all swamped at the moment. My website is serving as a Wayne Root for President info area for the time being. I even started a regular feature just this morning, called “Wayne Watch.” So your question is rather timely. I’ll try to update the Wayne Watch area at least twice a week with new and exciting news on his campaign.

    I can tell you that Wayne is super, super, super busy at the moment with the Super Bowl this weekend, understandably so. He’s also just launched his “Wayne Root Fantasy Football League” which is a huge $$$ multi-million venture. He’s been flying back and forth to New York City every week to meet with his business associates and promoters.

    He has indicated to me that come mid-February he should be on a little bit more relaxed schedule and will be able to devote more time to the Presidential race.

    I can tell you this. He has filled out the Libertarian Party’s form for stances on issues for the Presidential contenders, and sent it back to them. My understanding is that it will be printed in full in the next LP News.

  69. Eric Dondero Says:

    One final point Bill. We have had a Wayne Root for President Yahoo Group for almost a month now. We have 10 members. All have been highly screened. But I have been considering open it up to a few more Wayne Root supporters. So, if you’re a trusted Wayne Root guy, shoot me an email and I’ll likely approve your membership.

    PLEASE NO FAKE NAMES OR ATTEMPTS TO CONDUCT INTELLIGENCE ON WAYNE ROOT FOR PRESIDENT. I’ve got a keen sense of smell. And can sense a Rat a mile away.

  70. Eric Dondero Says:

    Tsk, tsk, tsk Andy. Was that a teensy weensy Racial slut you just hurled at Rudy Giuliani? He’s Italian, so he must be a little Fascist, right?

    Careful, Joe Biden just lost a Presidential bid today for a racial slur.

  71. Eric Dondero Says:

    Right! Hillary supports the War on Islamo-Fascism just like George W. Bush, which is to say not much. They both support a “politically correct” War on Islamo-Fascism; no bombing of Iraqi cities by our bombers, can’t mention the enemy as Islamo-Fascists, can’t expand the War to Syria or Iraq to catch other Islamo-Fascists, can’t piss off our friends the Saudis.

    Shiiiiit. Hillary and George support only a Quasi-War on Islamo-Fascism. They’re not total weenies like some in this Forum who want to just hand the United States over to the Islamo-Fascists, but they’re not Warrior in this War on Islamo-Fascism either.

    They’re “Warrior lites.”

  72. John Brown Says:

    “Giuliani is the Hero of 9/11.”

    More like the Nero of 9/11. Feel free to use that folks!

  73. John Brown Says:

    Yeah, Giuliani is only a fascist because he’s Italian and Schwarzenegger is only a nazi because he’s Austrian. It has nothing to do with their ideology.

    What we really need’s more Fascist-Likudniks because they don’t allready have a spot on the majoritarian party ticket. Righto!

  74. John Brown Says:

    Of course, if you are an Fascist pretending to be a libertarian, Ted Nugent, Rudy Giuliani, Tammy Bruce, et.al. would appear to be “libertarian” from your standpoint.

  75. John Brown Says:

    “Look at Bruce Cohen. He’s Chairman of the largest Libertarian Party County affiliate in the Nation, and Co-Host of the annual largest LP Convention in the Nation: Orange County LP Chairman and Caliornia LP Conv. Host.

    Bruce’s views and mine are virtually identical. We are ideological twins. We’re Mainstream Libertarians who wish to move the libertarian movement into the political mainstream.

    Bruce is a passionate Libertarian Party supporter. I respect that, as his friend. I’m a passionate Republican supporter. He respects me on that.

    Besides Bruce there’s all the gents in the Libertarian Reform Caucus, Bob Hunt, Tim Starr, Jeannie Starr, and a whole host of other “Moderate or Mainstream Libetarians” who are Libertarian Party members.

    Yes, most Moderate Libertarians are Republicans. But many are LPers.”

    Yes, they are a Republican Fifth Column and should be rooted (and booted) out.

  76. John Brown Says:

    “I am not a Minarchist. I think the term is ridiculous.”

    True, Erikkk is a Maxarchist.

  77. matt Says:

    On planet Eric,noting someone’s (Italian) ancestry and their propensity towards fascism in the same sentence constitutes a racial slur.

    Like this:
    “Italian Fascist”

    However, citizens of planet Eric can comfortably impugn an entire religion (and by extension 90% of the middle east) by writing this:

    “Islamo-Fascism”

    See how that works?

    *this public service announcement providded by matt, who, to the best of his knowledge, has never given anyone a good reason to call him a Teutono-Hebraic-Aboriginal-Balkanist-Fascist

  78. John Brown Says:

    “I’ve got a keen sense of smell. And can sense a Rat a mile away.”

    True, rats have a grreat sense of smell and they recognize their own kind.

  79. General Lee Says:

    Hillary is a raging warmonger bitch.

    http://lastfreevoice.wordpress.com/2007/02/01/when-hillary-attacks/

  80. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 1st, 2007 at 7:14 pm
    Tsk, tsk, tsk Andy. Was that a teensy weensy Racial slut you just hurled at Rudy Giuliani? He’s Italian, so he must be a little Fascist, right?”

    No, Rudy is a fascist because of his VIEWS and his ACTIONS. The only reason that I brought up him being Italian is because you always rally against “Islamofascists” and I was pointing out that a guy that you support has similiar views as the “Islamofascists” and is of Italian ancestory.

    Aaron Russo is an Italian Jew and he’s a great freedom fighter.

  81. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 1st, 2007 at 7:18 pm
    Right! Hillary supports the War on Islamo-Fascism just like George W. Bush, which is to say not much. They both support a “politically correct” War on Islamo-Fascism; no bombing of Iraqi cities by our bombers, can’t mention the enemy as Islamo-Fascists, can’t expand the War to Syria or Iraq to catch other Islamo-Fascists, can’t piss off our friends the Saudis.

    Shiiiiit. Hillary and George support only a Quasi-War on Islamo-Fascism. They’re not total weenies like some in this Forum who want to just hand the United States over to the Islamo-Fascists, but they’re not Warrior in this War on Islamo-Fascism either.

    They’re ‘Warrior lites.’”

    It sounds to me like you are in favor of genocide. Tell us Eric, what is your FINAL SOLUTION to the “Muslim problem”? Do you favor concentration camps or just bombing them all back to the stone age?

  82. Eric Dondero Says:

    I’m in favor of stopping genocide. Genocide by Islamo-Fascists on the American people. They already got 3,000 of us. Let’s stop them from killing the rest of us.

  83. Eric Dondero Says:

    Wow John Brown. That’s quite a statement there. You’re talking about purging about 1/3rd of the Libertarian Party including the current National Chairman Bill Redpath.

    The LP tried the purge route once before back in 1983. The Radical Anarchists booted out Ed Crane, David Koch, Roger MacBride, and all the people with the political smarts and money.

    Result: The LP’s vote total from 1980 dropped from 1 million to 228,000 in 1984.

    You sure you want to go down that purge route?

  84. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 1st, 2007 at 7:13 pm
    One final point Bill. We have had a Wayne Root for President Yahoo Group for almost a month now. We have 10 members.”

    Wow, 10 whole members. Wayne Root certainly has a lot of grass roots support. BAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA!

    “I can tell you that Wayne is super, super, super busy at the moment with the Super Bowl this weekend, understandably so. He’s also just launched his “Wayne Root Fantasy Football League” which is a huge $$$ multi-million venture. He’s been flying back and forth to New York City every week to meet with his business associates and promoters.

    He has indicated to me that come mid-February he should be on a little bit more relaxed schedule and will be able to devote more time to the Presidential race.”

    If he’s really going to run for the Libertarian Presidential race he ought to spend a little more time studying libertarian philosophy and the issues. But then again, why bother with a bunch pesky details? We should be about style over substance! Then we can be a big empty shell like the Reform Party! Yipeee!

  85. Andy Says:

    “I’ve got a keen sense of smell. And can sense a Rat a mile away.”

    This was my reaction when I learned of the Wayne Root for President campaign.

  86. Kn@ppster Says:

    Quoth Eric Dondero:

    “Wow John Brown. That’s quite a statement there. You’re talking about purging about 1/3rd of the Libertarian Party including the current National Chairman Bill Redpath.

    “The LP tried the purge route once before back in 1983. The Radical Anarchists booted out Ed Crane, David Koch, Roger MacBride, and all the people with the political smarts and money.”

    Actually, they “booted out” no one. There are no provisions from expulsion from the national LP, period, end of story. Crane, Koch et al got pissed off when they didn’t get their preferred presidential candidate nominated, and walked out in a huff. That’s not a “purge” any more than leaving a restaurant when you can’t get a waiter to take your order is “being escorted out of a restaurant by the police.”

    Dondero makes a big deal of some kind of “not welcome” language used with him by Michael Cloud at the 1983 convention, but Cloud had, and has, no more power to purge Dondero than Dondero had, or has, to purge Cloud.

    All of this is a tempest in a teapot, anyway. It’s exceedingly unlikely that Root or any other GOP mole will get a real shot at the LP’s presidential nomination. I don’t know whether Dondero is too clueless to realize that, or whether he does know it and is just hoping to keep the LP tied up in internal disputation knots (and therefore out of his big government buddies’ way) in the short term so that he can fulfill his previously publicly stated long-term goal of destroying it later.

    Tom Knapp

  87. Bill Wood Says:

    It is good that Wayne Root has joined the Libertarian Party, as it would be good for anyone else no matter what their past political party affilation has been to join. If they are for smaller government and individual liberty then they are well on their way to being libertarians. As people start exploring libertarian issues and they think things all the way through they tend to become more libertarian. I know Mr. Root has stated he will continue supporting Liberty leaning republicans and I say good for him. I think he might someday realize that the republican party is to “broken” to fix.

    I use to be a republican (before I even heard the word libertarian). I worked at the local level helping republicans to get elected etc. I thought the republcan party stood for limited government and personal freedoms. Then after the Republcans took total control of the federal government, I said this is great, now we’ll see reduced spending and a reverse of governmet growth and boy oh boy the Contract with America was a great idea. Damn! if they didn’t have me fooled. They turned out to outspend and outgrow government alot faster than the Democrats. So much for being a Republican, and to this day I thank C-Span for airing Harry Brown.

    So like a couple other people here I no longer have any faith with the Republican Party and I feel if you want a more limited government and one that follows the “Bill of Rights” why would you waste your time and money supporting a political party that is for the total opposite.

    Sorry! I’ve been rambling.

  88. John Brown Says:

    All of this is a tempest in a teapot, anyway. It’s exceedingly unlikely that Root or any other GOP mole will get a real shot at the LP’s presidential nomination. I don’t know whether Dondero is too clueless to realize that, or whether he does know it and is just hoping to keep the LP tied up in internal disputation knots (and therefore out of his big government buddies’ way) in the short term so that he can fulfill his previously publicly stated long-term goal of destroying it later.

    Probably the second thing.

    Toward the end of this video, which presentes the real truth about American media, business and politics we get an accurate picture of Erikkk’s Master.

    http://lastfreevoice.wordpress.com/2007/02/02/sweetass-video/

    All hail; Rudolf!

  89. John Brown Says:

    “I’ve got a keen sense of smell. And can sense a Rat a mile away.”

    This was my reaction when I learned of the Wayne Root for President campaign.

    You sure got that right, even if you do hate Mexicans and gays. And I’m not saying you do, necessarily.

  90. John Brown Says:

    Wow John Brown. That’s quite a statement there. You’re talking about purging about 1/3rd of the Libertarian Party including the current National Chairman Bill Redpath.

    Redpath is a warmonger? Pleeeze provide quotes and evidence. I heard about him being a gun grabber, sort of.

    Yeah, purge the warmongers – no question. No doubt, it would be a good start.

    There can be no party worth half a shit that allows warmongers among its ranks.

  91. matt Says:

    I’ll second that! I’d vote for a hermaphroditic iguana before I vote for a pro-war candidate, and I’m not the only one.

  92. undercover_anarchist Says:

    Jesus fucking Christ I’m so tired of hearing Andy’s “if we lived in a perfect libertarian society” excuse for his racist, Know-Nothing beliefs.

    Andy – you are a racist. Go lynch yourself.

    “Sure, I’m pro-2nd amendment… IF WE LIVED IN A PERFECT LIBERTARIAN SOCIETY. But the fact is that the welfare state produces criminals by distorting the free market. We have to deal with reality, and the reality is that we need to keep guns out of people’s hands. Also, I would never be for forced sterilization IF WE LIVED IN A PERFECT LIBERTARIAN SOCIETY, but as it is, Negroes and Mexicans (not even real Americans, btw) have babies they can’t pay for, and that isn’t right! We need to sterlize them until the welfare state is defeated. And finally, I would be for religious freedom IF WE LIVED IN A LIBERTARIAN SOCIETY. But the fact is that the Jew bankers and media owners distort upstanding libertarian ideals and promote the liberal weflare state. Don’t even get me started on the Jews and Communists who control the Federal Reserve! I’m no fan of Hitler, but we need to deport these Jews, and when I say ‘deport,’ I mean from this earth. Not that I’m anti-semetic.. Or at least I wouldn’t be IF WE LIVED IN A PERFECT LIBERTARIAN SOCIETY.” – Andy

  93. undercover_anarchist Says:

    Genocide? If there were four 9/11s a year for the next 80 years, you would still have a better chance of getting hit by lighting than dying at the hands of a terrorist. That’s hardly a “genocide.”

    Of course, Dondero would more of a chance of dying from AIDS caught from one of his wild swinging parties than anything else.

    I’m all for genocide of Nazis posing as “libertarians,” the ultimate Orwellian farce… Hitlerian scumbags like Dondipshit, Ron Paul, Boortz, etc. Throw them in a gas shower with their ideological cousins, the “islamo-fascists” of the middle east and let them all fucking die.

  94. undercover_anarchist Says:

    Bill Wood sounds like the type of former Republican I could stomach – and not in a Dondero sort of way.. ayyyyyyyyyyy0o

  95. Bill Wood Says:

    Thanks UA! I also enjoy beer and cigars ;-)

  96. Chris Says:

    Supposedly, votes were hacked in Ohio, makes you wonder if some of Peroutka’s may have either been taken or added.

  97. Captain AMerica Says:

    Eric Dondero is obviously a Bushite, not a Libertarian. Seig Heil Eric and report to Central Services!
    I prefer a red pill to Servile State Worship

    Guiliani is pro-abort, anti-Gun, pro-NWO and probably had pre 9/11 knowledge.

    He has made some big $$$

    Long live ALex Jones

    http://stopneocons.bravejournal.com/

  98. matt Says:

    I’m no fan of Hitler, but we need to deport these Jews, and when I say ‘deport,’ I mean from this earth. Not that I’m anti-semetic
    ==========================
    Of course not! You can say whatever you want, since you couldn’t possibly be racist. How could you be, after all, with all the talk you do about sharing spit with racists, etc. I hate neocon propaganda just as badly as you do. Probably everyone on the site hates it. Somehow, though, we all avoid saying “deport these jews from the earth”. Not even the “thinly veiled hate parties” you speak of (LP and CP) tolerate such talk.

  99. Cutty Sark Says:

    What happens in the booth, should stay in the booth.

  100. mcvlpkhr Says:

    mcvlpkhr

    mcvlpkhr

  101. Eric Dondero Says:

    Catpain America, take the NeoCon test now up at www.libertarianrepublican.blogspot.com. It was essentially developed by my old boss Congressman Ron Paul of Texas. There’s 17 questions. It’s quick, fun and easy.

    Out of 17 I scored a 2.5, maybe a 3.0. Which means I failed miserably. I’m more of an Anti-NeoCon.

    The biggest problem with NeoCons as I see it is that they are Religious Rightists, hardcore Social Conservatives who hate individual liberty, like Bill Bennett, Bill Kristol, Fred Barnes, et.al.

    I think we libertarians disagree with them vehemently on the Drug War for instance, but also on Pro-Choice on other sexal matters.

  102. Eric Dondero Says:

    Corrections for Tom Knapp. That was the 1989 Libertarian Party National Convention in Philadelphia where Michael Cloud made those statements and engaged in a purge against the “Ron Paulist” like me, not 1983. As soon as their Bergland-backed candidate won the LP Nomination for Chairman Cloud, we called him Emerling at the time, turned to me and said, “You and your Ron Paul friends are no longer welcome in the Libertarian Party…” Lew Rockwell and Jeff Tucker were sitting two seats away from me and he turned to them also when he made the statement. Ironically, he thought Lew and I were allied, which we were clearly not.

    Now, if you’re trying to say that Michael Emerling Cloud never physically booted us out of the Convention Hall, you are correct. But announcing that his forces had won, and that we were to be stripped of all our power and positions, and “no longer welcome” is pretty damned close to the definition of a “Purge” if not entirely close.

    I dare say even the strongest critics of me here, would agree with me on this point Tom.

  103. Eric Dondero Says:

    Captain America:

    “Bushite” I am not. I used to be. In fact, I created and launched “Libertarians for Bush” in 2004 after Badnarik won the nomination from Russo and Nolan.

    But Bush lost me with his idiotic support for the Port Dubai deal. He’s supposed to be this Great Warrior on Islamo-Fascism, yet he was prepared to hand over our ports to Radical Muslim sympathizers and funders.

    Bush has used the term “Islamo-Fascism” a grand total of 1 time.

    No, he’s more like his Dad. He wins a War, a glorious victory, but then he doesn’t want to finish the job.

    We should have bombed the shit out of Falujah. We should have pursued those trucks carrying the WMD into Syria and bombed the shit out of them too. Instead Bush flinched.

    He’s more of a Liberal these days. He’s gone soft on the War on Terror.

  104. Eric Dondero Says:

    On Wayne Root, we’ve got 10 members to the Yahoo Group cause that’s what I’ve limited too. It’s a private insiders group, not open to the public.

    We might in the future have another open Yahoo Group.

    And interestinly I note Root is clobbering the opposition here at Austin Cassidy’s Presidential Poll.

  105. undercover_anarchist Says:

    Matt, you are a real dumbass. My quote was satire. I’m 100% pro-Jew and 51% pro-Israel.

  106. undercover_anarchist Says:

    At least the Jewish-Nazi Kristol has the sense to be pro-immigration, unlike the racist Dondildo.

  107. matt Says:

    My apologies, ua. In my defense, I was rather skeptical of your quote when I first read it, since it did seem a tad out of character. Finally, I decided that you must have been sincere, since it sounded irrational and overblown and thus had a lot in common with your actual opinions. Perhaps if you didn’t have a history of ranting like a crazy person it would be easier for people to determine when you are being satirical.

  108. matt Says:

    Ironically, he thought Lew and I were allied, which we were clearly not.
    ==========================
    No, Eric, you and Lew are not allied. If you were I would be sending you money. And you would deserve it. You aren’t, I’m not, and you don’t.

  109. Eric Dondero Says:

    Dondero’s stance on immigration:

    100% Pro-Bush Guest Worker Program. All Mexicans who pass a criminal background check and wish to work in the United States should be welcomed. But if they wish to become US Citizens they should be required to both learn English, and pass a Test on Libertarian beliefs and US History and swear allegiance to the United States.

    Fast track for Mexican citizenship for all young Mexican men who join the US Armed Forces.

    Immigration should be restricted from Central and South America. Mexicans should always be given preference since they are our neighbors and understand our culture better than other foreigners.

    Immigration from Asian and European and African nations should continue at current levels. Immigration from Middle Eastern Nations should be severely restricted, if allowed at all.

    Of course, Canadians (and Brits & Aussies) should be able to come and go pretty much as they please.

  110. Andy Says:

    “Bill Wood Says:

    February 2nd, 2007 at 12:13 pm
    It is good that Wayne Root has joined the Libertarian Party, as it would be good for anyone else no matter what their past political party affilation has been to join. If they are for smaller government and individual liberty then they are well on their way to being libertarians. As people start exploring libertarian issues and they think things all the way through they tend to become more libertarian. I know Mr. Root has stated he will continue supporting Liberty leaning republicans and I say good for him.

    Wayne Root still supports Republicans who are for big government. On his website he sings the praises of the Bush administration and John McCain.

    “I think he might someday realize that the republican party is to “broken” to fix.”

    Until he realizes this he should not be a Libertarian candidate.

  111. Andy Says:

    “undercover_anarchist Says:

    February 2nd, 2007 at 3:27 pm
    Jesus fucking Christ I’m so tired of hearing Andy’s “if we lived in a perfect libertarian society” excuse for his racist, Know-Nothing beliefs.

    Andy – you are a racist. Go lynch yourself.”

    How in the FUCK do you know this? You don’t know me, and you don’t know what the FUCK you are talking about? You are an irrational leftist fool!

    So I’m a “racist” according to somebody who thinks that the Federal Reserve is good, eminent domain is OK, taxation is necessary, and opposition to Affirmative Action is “racist” and anyone who disagrees with him in general is a “racist”. I don’t consider you to be a credible source. Your ascertation would certainly be news to my black, Asian, Jewish, and hispanic friends.

  112. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 3rd, 2007 at 2:11 pm
    Dondero’s stance on immigration:

    100% Pro-Bush Guest Worker Program.”

    Not suprising since you support just about anything Bush does, and even when Bush does something you disagree with you still end up suporting him.

  113. Andy Says:

    “Fast track for Mexican citizenship for all young Mexican men who join the US Armed Forces.”

    This is one of the real reasons behind illegal immigration. The US military industrial complex needs more bodies. They are actually targeting poor hispanic immigrants for military recruitment. In fact, the US military has actually sent recruiters into Mexico. They are even recruiting immigrants with criminal backgrounds.

    Why be alarmed by this? Because the New World Order wants to use these people for the martial law takeover of America. Also, the military can exploits these poor, desperate individuals by sending them to fight in bullshit wars in Iraq and elsewhere. Dictators love foreign mercenary troops because they are more likely to blindly follow orders and will have less qualms about turning on the population. The New World Order wants more foreign troops in America because they can be used to achieve their long term goals of house to house gun confiscation raids and rounding up political dissidents.

  114. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 3rd, 2007 at 8:19 am
    Catpain America, take the NeoCon test now up at www.libertarianrepublican.blogspot.com. It was essentially developed by my old boss Congressman Ron Paul of Texas. There’s 17 questions. It’s quick, fun and easy.

    Out of 17 I scored a 2.5, maybe a 3.0. Which means I failed miserably. I’m more of an Anti-NeoCon.”

    This is only becuse you lied when you took the test. Of course lying is a common trait among neo-cons. This is based on evidence contained in numerous internet postings by you, and also your radio appearances on Harry Browne’s old show and on that program with George Phillies.

    You very well may not be in total agreement with neo-cons, but you certainly agree with them on their biggest issues.

  115. Andy Says:

    “We should have bombed the shit out of Falujah.”

    Oh yeah, who gives a shit about all of those innocent people that live there. Just kill them all.

    Maybe somebody should bomb the shit out of Eric Dondero’s hometown just because he lives there.

  116. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 3rd, 2007 at 8:38 am
    Captain America:

    “Bushite” I am not. I used to be. In fact, I created and launched “Libertarians for Bush” in 2004 after Badnarik won the nomination from Russo and Nolan.”

    The fact that you created an abomination like “Libertarians for Bush” is proof that you are not a REAL libertarian. If you didn’t think that Badnarik was a good candidate that’s one thing, but this does not justify supporting one of the most – in not the most – anti-libertarian Presidents ever in George W. Bush.

    “But Bush lost me with his idiotic support for the Port Dubai deal. He’s supposed to be this Great Warrior on Islamo-Fascism, yet he was prepared to hand over our ports to Radical Muslim sympathizers and funders.”

    Isn’t this a WAKE UP CALL for you that the entire “War On Terror” is a SHAM? Hello, anyone home?

  117. Bill Wood Says:

    Andy, I think Wayne Root has the right to run for the nomination, as any Libertarian Party Member has, however those seeking the nomination still have to win the approval of the Libertarian Party members at the National Convention. Now it is possible for someone to “stack the Convention” if they can grow the Party with enough supporters and get them to the Convention, it would take about 500, since only about 1000 members attend.

  118. Eric Dondero Says:

    Andy, on the NeoCon test, not only did I not agree with about 14 out of 17 of those Test Questions, but on about 7 of them, I staunchly disagreed with them.

    So, it was more like 3 questions, Staunchly Agree, 7 questions, Mostly Disagree, 7 questions, Totally Disagree. Which does not indicate me “lying” about the answers as you seem to indicate above.

    Even if proposing that I answered all those “Mostly Disagree” questions as an Affirmative “Yes” that would still only give me a score of 10 out of 17.

    Face it, you can’t just stomach the fact that not all individuals who are in favor of a War on Islamo-Fascism are not NeoCons.

    You need to also acknowledge that not even all “Conservatives” who are in favor of the War are NeoCons. Have you ever heard of “Reagan Republicans”? Or “Defense Conservatives”? These Reaganites despise the NeoCons like George Will, Fred Barnes, Bill Bennett, Kristol, Kraughthammer and such.

    Just because one is in favor of the War does not mean one is a “NeoCon.”

    And what of the guys serving over there right now in the Army and the Marines? They staunchly support the War. Are they NeoCons too?

  119. Eric Dondero Says:

    LOL. Andy, you are such a dumbass. Do you know anything about Mexico and the Mexican people? You claim to be a Californian, you don’t sound like one. Maybe you live in the tippy-ity tip top of Cali, near the Oregon border where there are no Mexicans. Certainly not El Centro, Indio or other parts of southern Cal.

    Y, sin dudo, no hables nada de espanol. Eres un pinche burro, que no puede entender nada de la cultura de Mexico, ninguno la gente. Chingale hombre. !Y vayase al diablo!

    IN MEXICO THE MEXICAN GOVERNMENT HAS NEAR MANDATORY MILITARY SERVICE! There are a few exceptions, but for the most part, young Mexican men must serve 2 years in the Mexican Military.

    Now compare that with the US. We haven’t had a Draft since 1973.

    And here you are crying about American Military Recruiters going into Mexican neighborhoods to offer poor struggling Mexicans who came here illegally, a job for 3 to 4 years, making 100 times the amount of money they could make in Mexico, having three square meals a day, a warm bed, and an adventure of a lifetime, with the possibility of paid college tuition afterwards to boot!

    Dude, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY INSANE!! (Not a racsist, like that asshole UA claims you to be), just an extreme dumbass. Put down that funky-smelling doobie Dude. Get in the real world.

  120. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 4th, 2007 at 11:09 am
    LOL. Andy, you are such a dumbass. Do you know anything about Mexico and the Mexican people? You claim to be a Californian, you don’t sound like one. Maybe you live in the tippy-ity tip top of Cali, near the Oregon border where there are no Mexicans.”

    I’ve never claimed to be a “Californian”. I was not born in California and I’ve lived in several states throughout the course of my life. The time that I have spent in California has been almost all in Southern California.

    “IN MEXICO THE MEXICAN GOVERNMENT HAS NEAR MANDATORY MILITARY SERVICE! There are a few exceptions, but for the most part, young Mexican men must serve 2 years in the Mexican Military.

    Now compare that with the US. We haven’t had a Draft since 1973.”

    So what? Does this mean that the military draft or even joining the military voluntarily are good things? Considering how corrupt our government is I do not consider joining the military to be a positive. All you are doing when you join the military is serving lying politicians and the military industrial complex.

    “And here you are crying about American Military Recruiters going into Mexican neighborhoods to offer poor struggling Mexicans who came here illegally, a job for 3 to 4 years, making 100 times the amount of money they could make in Mexico, having three square meals a day, a warm bed, and an adventure of a lifetime, with the possibility of paid college tuition afterwards to boot!”

    How is it that the military is able to hire people and offer them benifits? BECAUSE THEY ARE FUNDED THROUGH TAXATION! The tax collectors STEAL money from productive people and hand it over to the military. The military budget is a monstrousity that eats up HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS each year. According to this Wikipedia entry – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Us_military – the US military budget is currently an astronomical $522 BILLION. Exert from the Wikipedia entry:

    “The United States military budget is larger than the military budgets of the next twenty largest spenders combined, and six times larger than China’s, which places second. The United States and its closest allies are responsible for approximately two-thirds of global military spending (of which, in turn, the U.S. is responsible for the vast majority). Military spending accounts for 19% of the United States’ federal budget, and approximately half of its federal discretionary spending, which comprises all of the U.S. government’s money not accounted for by pre-existing obligations.”

    Now just imagine if some or even all of this $522 BILLION that is spent on the military were put back into the hands of the people who earned it. For the sake of discussion, let’s say that half of it – which comes out to $261 BILLION - were put back into the hands of the people who earned it. $261 BILLION would provide a HUGE boost to the economy, which would create a lot of jobs in the private sector. This would give the average person more money to spend on goods and services that they actually want and need, rather than being wasted on an overbloated military budget.

  121. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 4th, 2007 at 10:57 am
    Andy, on the NeoCon test, not only did I not agree with about 14 out of 17 of those Test Questions, but on about 7 of them, I staunchly disagreed with them.

    So, it was more like 3 questions, Staunchly Agree, 7 questions, Mostly Disagree, 7 questions, Totally Disagree. Which does not indicate me ‘lying’ about the answers as you seem to indicate above.

    Even if proposing that I answered all those ‘Mostly Disagree’ questions as an Affirmative “Yes” that would still only give me a score of 10 out of 17.

    Face it, you can’t just stomach the fact that not all individuals who are in favor of a War on Islamo-Fascism are not NeoCons.”

    I’ve already acknowledged that you probably do have some differences with neo-conservatives. However, by your own admission you agree with them on their most important definitional issues. You are at the very least an ALLY of the neo-cons. Here’s a term to describe you that should be more to your liking: neo-libertarian. Check out the Wikipedia entry on it.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-libertarians

    Here’s another term to describe your views, although you may not like this one as much: liberventionist.

    Liberventionists: The Nationalist Internationalists
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/gregory/gregory51.html

    “You need to also acknowledge that not even all ‘Conservatives’ who are in favor of the War are NeoCons.”

    I would say that they are almost all neo-cons. REAL conservatives (ie-the paleoconservatives) are opposed to the war.

    “And what of the guys serving over there right now in the Army and the Marines? They staunchly support the War. Are they NeoCons too?”

    I would say that they are brainwashed and naive. A lot of them are probably neo-cons as well.

    Not all military people support the war. Some of them have actually come out as critics of the war.

  122. Cutty Sark Says:

    Actually the most recent poll I saw was 73% of active duty troops are against the war which is probably an underestimate since some troops might be paranoid about expressing their true opinion and don’t realize they have the right to oppose the war.

    Also the estimate of military spending from Wikipedia is low, it’s only the direct military budget and does not include a lot of hidden military spending.

    Eric is a tool.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cu6pw5vtswE

  123. Andy Says:

    I’m reposting these links about the effects of Depleted Uranium on Iraqi babies because Eric conviently ignored them. What’s the matter Eric, afraid to admitt that you support baby killers?

    Photos of Babies Deformed Because of Depleted Uranium
    http://www.mindfully.org/Nucs/2003/DU-Baby2003.htm

    Extreme Birth Deformities in Iraq
    http://www.uksociety.org/us_crimes_against-humanity_1.htm

  124. Andy Says:

    “Also the estimate of military spending from Wikipedia is low, it’s only the direct military budget and does not include a lot of hidden military spending.”

    You are right about this. I’ve heard that the real figure is over $1 TRILLION.

  125. Cutty Sark Says:

    Eric is such a fucking military hero, how many battles did he ever see?

    Did he kill anyone or get shot at? Did he watch any of his friends die?

    Oh yeah, a different ship that he was not on got shot down.

    Or maybe he was just another douchebag sucking off his fellow sailors on a boat and raping hookers in ports all over the world courtesy of Uncle Sam and the IRS to make the world safe for Halliburton, Enron, GE and Exxon.

  126. Eric Dondero Says:

    Hey Frankel, is that you? Got a new name I see. Cutty Sark, isn’t that a whisky brand? Stole if from a tossed away whisky bottle now did ya? Couldn’t come up with something more original than that?

    Then again, if you spend your time running away from officials hanging out at trashed out bus stops all over the country I could see where you’d get such an idea for a faux name.

  127. Eric Dondero Says:

    Andy, the ONLY SINGLE THING I SHARE IN COMMON WITH NEOCONS is Bill Bennett’s love for 1960s pop music. That’s it.

    NeoCons are prudish Religious Right Conservatives. They are opposed to my stances on issues on just about every social issue imaginable.

    Maybe we agree on lowering taxes for families, but that’s about it.

  128. Eric Dondero Says:

    Aha, you avoided the question Andy.

    Again, let’s get real specific here. You acknowledge that there are “some Military guys who support the War but are not NeoCons.” So then, how do you classify these individuals? What political label do you give them?

    Do you acknowledge that there’s a political category called “Reagan Republicans” or “Defense Conservatives”?

    Was Alexander Haig a “NeoCon”? No, he was a Defense Conservative.

    Of all the people who support a Strong National Defense, NeoCons are but a very tiny segment. So why so much attention thrown their way?

  129. Eric Dondero Says:

    Andy: The tax collectors STEAL money from productive people and hand it over to the military. The military budget is a monstrousity that eats up HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS each year. According to this Wikipedia entry – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Us_military – the US military budget is currently an astronomical $522 BILLION. Exert from the Wikipedia entry:

    There you have it folks. Andy is an Anarchist. He is not a libertarian. He just admitted it to the world. He wishes to abolish the American Military. Thus, he believes in No Government, and he is an Anarchist, NOT A LIBERTARIAN.

  130. Eric Dondero Says:

    Hey Andy, why even have a United States of America, huh? I mean since you want to abolish the Military and all. Tell me which foreign countries do you wish to hand our Nation over too?

    Do you want to give us to the UN maybe? China? Saudi Arabia? Maybe the EU? Canada?

    Just want to hand our country over to the highest bidder, huh?

    Tear up the American flag. Rewrite American history. Abolish the Star Spangled Banner. Andy’s plan for abolishing the United States of America.

  131. Cutty Sark Says:

    Erikkk, what the fuck are you talking about? Are you on crack? Cutty Sark is my real name, and I don’t even know who this Frank you are talking about is.

    And where the fuck did you get the stupid idea that an Anarchist is not a Libertarian? Did you pull that out of your ass like the rest of your bullshit opinions?

    You really should get some help with that, having a head so filled with shit can’t possibly be good for you.

  132. John Brown Says:

    You’ll have to excuse Eric. He had some dude he was sucking and fucking in bus station bathrooms all over the country, they broke up, and now he just can’t get over it.

    There’s lots of other men out there that would probably let Eric lick their anal cavity in a toilet stall, but hopefully he will realize that in time and get over the whole being rejected and obsession/stalker thing.

  133. Tom Blanton Says:

    To Mr. Dondero, Bush is a moderate libertarian.

    I would define Ron Paul as a moderate libertarian. In recent interviews, he has stated he is not an anarchist and that he will not run on a third party ticket.

    Taking Dr. Paul at his word, he will not run on the LP or CP ticket and he probably won’t run as an independent. In the unlikely event that he is nominated by the GOP, I would imagine that most LP and CP members would vote for him even if their parties were running a candidate.

    By the way, the Boston Tea Party, which has about 400 members, may have a handful of objectivists of the Ayn Rand Institute variety, but most members are anti-war, unlike the new breed of objectivists. There seems to be a wide variety of libertarians involved (or semi-involved as the case may be) including anarchists, minarchists, constitutionalists, and even moderates. Membership is also not limited to libertarians and many belong to other parties.

  134. Tom Blanton Says:

    Dondero says:

    “NeoCons are prudish Religious Right Conservatives. They are opposed to my stances on issues on just about every social issue imaginable.”

    This is factually inaccurate. Most neocons don’t give a rat’s ass about the religious right’s culture wars.

    Of course, when anyone who breathes looks like a “moderate libertarian” to Mr. Dondero, it is easy to see how he might be confused about what a neocon is.

  135. matt Says:

    Tear up the American flag. Rewrite American history. Abolish the Star Spangled Banner. Andy’s plan for abolishing the United States of America.

    I would rather do all of those things than see one Iota of the bill of Rights omitted. What is patriotism? Is it team loyalty, like to a sports team, or is it loving yourself and your family enough that you demand liberty? I prefer the latter, but then I’m not a vet. Maybe my opinion doesn’t matter.

  136. Andy Says:

    Eric Dondero Says:

    “February 4th, 2007 at 4:54 pm
    Hey Frankel, is that you? Got a new name I see. Cutty Sark, isn’t that a whisky brand? Stole if from a tossed away whisky bottle now did ya? Couldn’t come up with something more original than that?”

    I’m pretty sure that that’s not Frankel.

    “Then again, if you spend your time running away from officials hanging out at trashed out bus stops all over the country I could see where you’d get such an idea for a faux name.”

    I don’t think that he hangs out at “trashed out bus stops” very often.

  137. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 4th, 2007 at 4:57 pm
    Andy, the ONLY SINGLE THING I SHARE IN COMMON WITH NEOCONS is Bill Bennett’s love for 1960s pop music. That’s it.

    NeoCons are prudish Religious Right Conservatives. They are opposed to my stances on issues on just about every social issue imaginable.”

    Social issues are not what primarily define neo-cons. Neo-cons are primarily defined by FOREIGN POLICY issues. They support military imperialism.

    The top neo-cons are not even really religious, at least in the Christian sense of the term. If anything they are Satanist. Real Christians would not be affiliated with organizations such as The Bohemian Grove and The Order of Skull and Bones (both of which the Bush’s are members of). They merely pretend to be Christians because to trick stupid and naive people into voting for them.

    Dark Secrets Inside Bohemian Grove
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-82095917705734983&q=bohemian+grove&hl=en

    The Order Of Death
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2500924140588760933&q=order+of+death&hl=en

    Skull and Bones Wikipedia Entry
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skull_and_Bones

    Skull and Bones 322
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IBjk8FVLj8

    “Maybe we agree on lowering taxes for families, but that’s about it.”

    The neo-cons (at least the ones at the top) don’t really believe in lowering taxes. The Bush “tax cut” was a sham because it did not correspond with any cuts in spending. The value of the dollar has gone down and spending has skyrocketed since Bush took office.

  138. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 4th, 2007 at 5:04 pm
    Hey Andy, why even have a United States of America, huh? I mean since you want to abolish the Military and all. Tell me which foreign countries do you wish to hand our Nation over too?

    Do you want to give us to the UN maybe? China? Saudi Arabia? Maybe the EU? Canada?

    Just want to hand our country over to the highest bidder, huh?

    Tear up the American flag. Rewrite American history. Abolish the Star Spangled Banner. Andy’s plan for abolishing the United States of America.”

    Do you have a reading comprehension problem? Have you not seen my posts where I’ve been rallying against the New World Order, the North American Union (the proposed merger between Canada, Mexico, and the USA), and mass illegal immigration destroying America?

    If anyone is trying to destroy this country it is the neo-cons with whom you are aligned.

  139. Andy Says:

    “There you have it folks. Andy is an Anarchist. He is not a libertarian. He just admitted it to the world. He wishes to abolish the American Military. Thus, he believes in No Government, and he is an Anarchist, NOT A LIBERTARIAN.”

    Are you a newbie or something? You claim to have been around the movement since the 1980’s but it sure sounds like you don’t know what in the hell you are talking about.

    As I’ve said over and over again, a person can be an anarchist or a minarchist and still be a libertarian. An anarchist is a purist libertarian who wants a voluntary society. A minarchist does not think that anarchy is possible so they want government to be strictly limited to protecting individuals from the coercive use of force.

    I consider myself to be BOTH an anarchist and a strict constitutionalist minarchist at the same time. How can this be? Ideally I do not believe in the initiation of coercive force so taking this to it’s logical conclusion there would be no government. However, I also recognize that we are a LONG way from having this and I don’t know if it will ever happen or not. So as the next best thing I want to reduce government as much as possible. I don’t think that the Constitution is perfect but I do think that if government were strictly limited to the Constitution that most of the problems what we have would go away, so I think that as long as government exsists it should be “bound down by the chains of the Constitution” as Thomas Jefferson said.

    I think that the late Harry Browne did an excellent job of addressing this issue in the article below…

    How Small Should Government Be?

    by Harry Browne

    August 19, 2005

    Anthony Wile recently posted an article at FreeMarketnNews.com in which he urged that those who believe in small, limited government and those who believe in no government at all should quit arguing over their differences and unite to fight big government.

    It is a excellent article and well worth reading, but as I read it, it occurred to me that all such discussions seem to ignore one angle. We have an obvious motive to be working together without even trying to work together.

    Suppose there were a magic button sitting in front of you. And suppose that button would instantly reduce the federal government to only, say, $200 billion.

    Would you refuse to push the button — even if you want the federal government to be 0 dollars? Would you refuse to push the button — even if you think the federal government should be $500 billion?

    Once the federal government is only $200 billion, we can each go our separate way — trying to make the federal government exactly what each wants it to be. For some the federal government would be $200 billion too large, for others perhaps $300 too small. But for each a $2 trillion reduction in the size of government would be welcome. I doubt that there’s even one among us who would refuse to see the federal government at $200 billion as a first step.

    So why should we waste our time arguing now over where government should go once it’s down to $200 billion.

    Stating our Case

    I’m always arguing that government is way too big, that government programs don’t work, that free-market programs are much more effective, more fair, less expensive.

    From time to time, someone will ask me, “So how would you handle roads in your free society?”

    Instead of trying to convince someone that roads should be the province of the free market, and let the discussion be steered into esoterica — leaving listeners with the idea that this is all just an attractive pipe dream — I usually say:

    I have no doubt that roads — like anything else — would be far safer, far less expensive and far more practical if they were built and operated by private companies. But let’s stay within the realm of today’s possibilities. Let’s talk about reducing dramatically today’s $2½-trillion federal budget, about ending a scandalous welfare program, about stopping the wholesale destruction of our health-care and education systems by the federal government. In short let’s get government out of our lives wherever we can.

    If the questioner still wants to focus on roads, he will do so at the risk of losing the support of listeners who do want to talk about reducing government in their lives — in short, about two thirds or more of his audience.

    Poll after poll shows that the majority of Americans think government is much too big. This is a fertile field — one that’s ready to be shown that much smaller government can give them much more of what they want. We should be taking advantage of this bias, and pushing to mobilize this audience to flood their congressmen, legislators, governors, and the president with requests to enact legislation that will reduce and eliminate huge, bloated, government programs.

    The Future

    Once we’ve reduced government to $200 billion, I’ll personally head up a fund-raising drive to raise the money to rent the Super Bowl, so we can gather to argue how much smaller government should be.

    Until then, I refuse to join the arguments over the ideal size of government — despite any opinions I may harbor.

    How small should government be?

    Government is force, and we should be eager to remove force wherever possible from human affairs.

    So how small should government be?

    As small as humanly possible.

  140. Andy Says:

    “Again, let’s get real specific here. You acknowledge that there are “some Military guys who support the War but are not NeoCons.” So then, how do you classify these individuals? What political label do you give them?”

    What label would I put on them? Idiots. Sheep. The navie. The ignorant. Brainwashed. Any of those terms would be accurate.

  141. Andy Says:

    “Just want to hand our country over to the highest bidder, huh?”

    No, this is what Bush wants to do. Or did you forget about the Dubia ports deal? How about the ports that were handed over to the Chinese? How about the proposed North American Union which Bush has signed on to? How about the plan to use eminent domain and tax payer funding to build toll roads and then hand them over to a foreign corporation, and to have drivers billed by putting RFID chips in their license plates?

    Building A North American Community
    http://www.cfr.org/search.html?q=spp&ie=&site=cfr&output=xml_no_dtd&client=cfr&lr=&proxystylesheet=cfr&oe=&getfields=authors.pubtype&sort=date%3AD%3AS%3Ad1

    Bush Administration Quietly Plans NAFTA Superhighway
    http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=15497

    How NAFTA Superhighway is Built Under Radar Screen
    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=51730

    Trans Texas Corridor Catastrophe
    http://www.texastollparty.com/ttp_trans_texas.php

    Exert:

    “Secret deal with a private foreign company.
    Gov. Rick Perry has had secret negations with a company from Spain, Cintra, to hold a 70 year concession for a portion of the Corridor. Perry and Cintra/Zachery withheld the agreement from the public, claiming it included proprietary information, even though taxpayer dollars to the tune of $3.5 million is going to Cintra’s partner, Zachry, for planning.”

    I’d say that it is the people whom you align with who are the ones that are selling the country out.

  142. Andy Says:

    “Of all the people who support a Strong National Defense, NeoCons are but a very tiny segment. So why so much attention thrown their way?”

    Because the neo-cons are the ones who have the most power right now.

    Also, I’ve already said that assuming that you are telling the truth about your views you are more of a neo-libertarian or liberventionist. However, it should be noted that you are very quick to sell out whatever libertarian views that you really hold in the name of supporting the “War On Terror”. Why else would you support the likes of Bush, Giuliani, McCain, Lieberman, etc…? They clearly do NOT hold whatever libertarian principles that you espouse, so you are willing to throw all of that out just because they are pro-war.

  143. Andy Says:

    China’s Massive Ports Grab
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/ww3/china_massive_port_grab.htm

    Chinese Company Handed No-Bid Contracts On Key US Security Infastructure
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/infrastructure_chinese_military_handed_no_bid_contracts.htm

    China: New World Order Litmus Test
    http://infowars.net/articles/april2006/180406China.htm

    Exert:

    “Recently the Associated Press reported that Hutchison Whampoa Ltd was given a no-bid contract by the US government to take over radiation detecting security just 65 miles away from Freeport in the Bahamas with no oversight. Hutchinson Whampoa is admittedly a holding of the Chinese navy and the People’s Liberation Army.

    In 1997 the Communist Chinese government took over the Long Beach Naval Air Base, the only major deep water port that can take large ships on the west coast. In 2000, the Communist Chinese, Hutchinson Whampoa which is run by the PLA, took over the Panama Canal and has stationed between 15,000 and 30,000 troops at the facility.

    Topping even that, U.S. taxpayers are lending Westinghouse Electric Co. almost $5 billion to build nuclear power plants in China.

    American tax money is directly funding the might of the Chinese Red Army despite the fact that we are told over and over that they are the future military threat and despite top Chinese generals continue to threaten nuclear attacks on America.”

  144. Andy Says:

    Hey Eric, why do you keep dodging my questions about the effects of Depleted Uranium (which the US military uses as a weapon) on babies in Iraq? What’s the matter, are you too much of a COWARD to confront this issue?

    Photos Of Babies Deformed Because Of Depleted Uranium
    http://www.mindfully.org/Nucs/2003/DU-Baby2003.htm

    Extreme Birth Deformaties in Iraq
    http://www.uksociety.org/us_crimes_against-humanity_1.htm

  145. Eric Dondero Says:

    Guys, as a general rule, I stop responding to posts once they’ve dropped off the main page.

    So, see you all on the next thread…

  146. Eric Dondero Says:

    Andy, once last response. You mean like that movie The Hills Have Eyes? Yup, I agree, there is uranium still out there. My guess New Mexico and Nevada deserts far away from human populations.

  147. Trent Hill Says:

    “NeoCons are prudish Religious Right Conservatives.”

    Dondero, you’re a moron.

    Neocons are defined by a hawkish foreign policy which is driven by interventionism.
    Now wait for the truly angry part.

    You are not a libertarian. You are a moderate Republican.

  148. Andy Says:

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 5th, 2007 at 8:57 pm
    Guys, as a general rule, I stop responding to posts once they’ve dropped off the main page.

    So, see you all on the next thread…”

    Translation: Andy has me backed up against a wall and instead of admitting defeat I’m going to run and hide, but don’t worry, I’ll continue spewing forth my drivel on another thread soon.

    By the way, this thread is not off of the main page yet.

    “Eric Dondero Says:

    February 5th, 2007 at 8:58 pm
    Andy, once last response. You mean like that movie The Hills Have Eyes? Yup, I agree, there is uranium still out there. My guess New Mexico and Nevada deserts far away from human populations.”

    Are you on drugs?

  149. Winston Smith Says:

    Eric Dondero states in his link he is a Libertarian-yet oddly, his posts are much more Pro-Bush, not a Libertarian position at all, esp as Bush as a big time socialist and warmonger.

    IT is sorta chic these days-I guess-to claim to be Libertarian, yet take most of the Bush line.

    BTW- paul was your old boss? Guess why I see now that is in the past tense, doubtful he puts up with your Bushitism

  150. Breaking News Or Wind Or Something « his vorpal sword Says:

    [...] News Or Wind Or Something Jump to Comments SMOKING GUN UPDATE 4:04 AM PDT: Paul Singer is one of the three richest libertarians, according toRon Paul’s ex-Congressional Senior Aide and District Representative, Eric Dondero [Rittberg]: # Eric Dondero Says: January 30th, 2007 at 3:22 pm [...]

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